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>Can a human be found liable for this?

A father in Georgia was just convicted of second degree murder, child cruelty, and other charges because he failed to prevent his kid from shooting up his school.


More accurately it was because the father had multiple warnings that his child was mentally unstable but ignored them and handed his 14 year old a semiautomatic rifle even as the boy's mother (who did not live with them) pleaded to the father to lock all the guns and ammo up to prevent the kid from shooting people.

If he had only "failed to prevent his kid from shooting up a school" he wouldn't have even been charged with anything.


Doesn't google have the capability to have multiple warnings and yet still ignores them?


Google has legal personhood, but as a corporation its ethical responsibilities are much looser than those of an individual, and it's extremely hard to win a criminal case against a corporation even when its agents and representatives act in ways that would be criminal if they happened in a non-corporate context.

The law - in practice - is heavily weighted towards giving corporations a pass for criminal behaviour.

If the behaviour is really egregious and lobbying is light really bad cases may lead to changes in regulation.

But generally the worst that happens is a corporation can be sued for harm in a civil suit and penalties are purely financial.

You see this over and over in finance. Banks are regularly pulled up for fraud, insider dealing, money laundering, and so on. Individuals - mostly low/mid ranking - sometimes go to jail. But banks as a whole are hardly ever shut down, and the worst offenders almost never make any serious effort to clean up their culture.


When HSBC was caught knowingly laundering money for terrorists, cartels, and drug dealers all they had to do was apologize and hand the US government a cut of the action. It really seems less like the action of a justice system and more like a racketeering. Corporations really need to be reined in, but it's hard to find a politician willing to do it when they're all getting their pockets stuffed with corporate cash.


> as a corporation its ethical responsibilities are much looser than those of an individual

This seems ass backwards


ChatGPT thinks that they can identify when someone may not be mentally well. There's no reason to think that Google can't. In fact, I'm pretty sure Google has a list of the mental health issues of just about every person with a Google account in that user's dossier.


They were probably close friends because they weren't business competitors.


Until the Heritage Foundation succeeds in dismantling Wikipedia.


That makes me wonder what the Wikimedia Foundation's disaster recovery plan looks like.

The crucial bit of infrastructure (and the most vulnerable point right now) might be the domain name.


FWIW they have instructions for downloading the whole thing, which mention that it is also downloadable from BitTorrent. So I think it is functionally impossible to delete Wikipedia.

I’d be more worried about propaganda being inserted.


I'm not worried about the data, and even losing the servers would be a hiccup. But whatever site is at www.wikipedia.org is, in the minds of the general public, Wikipedia.

Domain names have been seized in the past.


I imagine most traffic to Wikipedia is through search, so I imagine such a fate is in the hands of search engines. If a community-driven alternative appeared, we'd have to rely on Google indexing this alternative and ranking it higher than the usurped domain.


Search is also vulnerable.

It's been called "wokepedia" (not to be confused with Wookieepedia, the star wars wiki) by Musk and others, telling people not to donate.

And also people have been denouncing Google's search results as biased, as being "woke".

I'm still not sure what any specific user of the word "woke" means, beyond the Ami/UK right using it as an insult, but I can't tell if it's generic or specific, critiquing something or just telling supporters when to boo and jeer. Does the Ami/UK left still use it to mean "being aware of systemic prejudice", or have they also shifted? I didn't notice at the time when "meme" stopped meaning shared online quiz.


> I'm still not sure what any specific user of the word "woke" means

In the context you're referring to it is essentially an accusation of certain ideological ulterior motives in communication.

Regarding your reference to Google's search results. I have no idea what the current behavior is. However a couple of years ago there were some remarkable differences for certain search terms between different geographical versions of the website. It certainly had the appearance of pushing an agenda at the time.


> I'm still not sure what any specific user of the word "woke" means, beyond the Ami/UK right using it as an insult, but I can't tell if it's generic or specific, critiquing something or just telling supporters when to boo and jeer. Does the Ami/UK left still use it to mean "being aware of systemic prejudice", or have they also shifted?

It is a mistake to think that negative uses of “woke” are an exclusively right-of-centre thing.

Rather than repeat myself, I’ll just link to this comment I posted a bit over a month back - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42695516 - in which I cite several unabashed Marxists using the word negatively (including Adolph L Reed Jr, and the Trotskyist International Committee of the Fourth International).

If you read Reed, he actually means something rather specific by “woke” - whereas classical/orthodox Marxism views non-class-based oppression (race, gender, sexuality, etc) as downstream consequences of class-based oppression, “wokeness” treats them as if they exist independently of class-based oppression, or as upstream of it, or as a higher priority than it

Just the other day, Senator Mark Warner (D-VA) was quoted as saying, regarding his own Democratic Party, that “I think the majority of the party realizes that the ideological purity of some of the groups is a recipe for disaster and that candidly the attack on over-the-top wokeism was a valid attack” - https://www.politico.eu/article/us-senator-mark-warner-democ... - Warner may well be a moderate or centrist Democrat, but I don’t think it makes sense to label him as “conservative” or “right-wing”. He’s not a “conservative Democrat”, in the sense that there was such a thing a decade or two ago [edit: I made some comment here about him not being a member of the Blue Dog caucus, but I’ve removed it because what I was saying didn’t really make sense-the Blue Dog caucus is and was a House caucus, while Warner is a Senator]

I don’t think Warner’s definition of “woke” is as precise as Reed’s, but essentially what he means by it is a form of progressivism which prioritises ideological purity over winning the battle for the median voter’s heart and mind


I see, then it has indeed shifted meaning again.

Thanks for the detailed response; one of the previous times I said this here, the answer was snarky disbelief that I hadn't kept track.


> I’d be more worried about propaganda being inserted.

FWIW, it would be far from the first time that’s happened (including for sensitive US issues).


It is loaded with propaganda right now.


>They're trying to provide an alternative to normal invite system - one that's been established and battle-tested over decades, one that works okay-ish across any device, real or virtual, on any platform, and one that people know how to use.

And if the people who try Invites discover that it isn't, in fact, superior to this "normal invite system"—whatever you believe it to be—that you claim is "established and battle-tested," they won't continue using it and will go back to what they were doing before.

>An alternative that gives some bells and whistles exclusively to the Apple users, and perhaps even is more ergonomic in practice.

Do you believe that all vendors should be forbidden from shipping any new application or feature that doesn't offer full interoperability and feature parity with everybody else or is that a limitation you believe should be applied only to Apple?


>Before Musk takeover certain opinions just weren't present and/or were actively silenced.

Care to provide some examples of "certain opinions" that were "actively silenced?"


Afaik, open nazi were actually silenced on twitter prior Musk. But, you could talking in euphemisms and it would be mostly fine. Also, when you went really really far with harassment.


Yes, that was rather my point.


Opinions regarding masking mandates and criticizing COVID-19 response in general, for example.


>Opinions regarding masking mandates and criticizing COVID-19 response in general, for example.

So they were cracking down on people spreading dangerous disinformation in the middle of a public health emergency. Okay.

What are some others?


>They can make stuff up, but saying "60% of the time they lie to you" hasn't been true for years.

If you're using them to fill knowledge gaps, what scaffolding have you set up to ensure that those gaps aren't being filled with incorrect-but-plausible-sounding information?


> I'm curious about the rationale behind this choice when nuclear power seems like a far superior option. Can someone shed light on this decision?

India’s plutonium has already been spoken for.


The economics of higher education in the United States are definitely ripe for reform—especially for public institutions—but I think we have much better places to be looking for ideas than the health insurance industry.


That was just an analogy, not the source of the idea. Government has been playing the carrots and sticks game a lot longer than the insurance industry.


>That Patreon is even considering keeping the app is proof of this.

No, that Patreon is "even considering" keeping the app is evidence that they get more valuable information about users and their habits from the app than they could from a website.


That's not disagreeing with me, but instead adding yet another argument for users to avoid as many Apps as they can.

If the experience in an app is form, graphs, and payments... use the website. It apparently saves that company 30% and, to your point, keeps your computing habits yours.


I doubt it. What evidence supports your claim? I took a look at the Patreon app permissions in Android, and it doesn't even ask for location which is probably the most valuable thing about users they could ask for.


The broad argument holds, regardless of what Patreon itself does right now.

Facts are simple here: Apps grant easier access your habits and identity as compared to a relatively-sandboxed browser.


> You could level similarly-contrived criticisms against humans where machines could do better too.

You’re not even going to build an actual strawman before claiming to have knocked it down?


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