Hacker Newsnew | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submitlogin

Studies can show anything if you cherry pick the right statistics out.

Personal experience says being a parent is one of the coolest and most enjoyable things you can do with your life.

You could also say that "being in a relationship makes people less happy" - quite likely true if you pick out the right statistics.



It's pretty funny when you criticize "cherry picking", then immediately cite "personal experience" as evidence for a position.


Yeah but the difference is, I labelled it as "personal experience", and not some sort of "study". I also did not state it was in any way evidence for anything.

I simply said that in my experience, it's been great fun... It's up to you though. Don't have kids.. Don't buy a house. Go travelling. Just don't get to 80 and wish you had done things differently.


You absolutely did use your opinion as an argument. Look at what you wrote:

"Personal experience says being a parent is one of the coolest and most enjoyable things you can do with your life."

If you weren't trying to use your personal opinion as as evidence, what you should have written was:

"Personal experience says being a parent is one of the coolest and most enjoyable things I did with my life."

The latter is a statement of opinion; the former is an argument.


Wow. Timr nailed it. It/They, You, I are very powerful context words. Next time you get in a real-life, face to face argument with someone and you want to escalate to shouting - start using you do this, you do that. I've overheard parents doing this with their kids many times. "Why don't you clean up your room?"

For bonus points, if you want to appear to be an elitist/snob to people you've just met say stuff like "This restaurant is the best" or "You should try this restaurant". I think this is called the God perspective (You passing judgement). (Always better to just make a statement of your opinion - "I like this place. Their food is different")


The OP is suggesting that a published study is "cherry-picking" data -- but isn't providing any evidence to support his claim. His only argument is his personal opinion.

It's sad that a blatant logical fallacy can become the second-highest-rated comment attached to this article.


Published or not, "happiness research" is notoriously difficult. It isn't exactly hard science.

Here's another personal opinion: our daughter is pretty much the most important thing I've ever done, and even if something like Hecl were to become hugely popular, she still would be to me, although perhaps not to the world at large. I would bet that someone like Linus might feel similarly.

Many other things you do in life might have significant impacts on lots of other people (perhaps adding up to 'more overall impact'), but a child's life and future is entirely in your hands, which is a huge responsibility.


Exactly, what happens when you get older and realize that you haven't actually DONE anything.

You will die and no one will actually blink an eye. YOU may have had great experiences, but if you have no one with to share them, after you die they are gone.

Start a great company? How many of the web 2.0 companies people are starting actually will change people's lives?


In eight generations time, about 200 years, your offspring will have 256 ancestors to learn about.

Do you really think they will bother if you have no other achievements other than having kids? How much do you know about your ancestors from the 1800s? How much do you know about the greatest scientests from the 1800s?

Immortality doesn't come from your children. For most of us we don't have a shot at it at all, of course. But as we will be dead I doubt we will care.


I said nothing of immortality, I said of SHARING. When I was 12-14 I used to go play golf with my grandfather and he would tell me stories of his time in WWII, or working on the nuclear tests after the war. My other grandfather used to take us out on his boat. Neither will be remembered in 200 years, but they both had a lot of fun sharing their stories with their grand kids.

As for immortaility, I don't care to get my name in a history book, but I do want to leave my mark on the world. I want to CHANGE something. One of my grandfathers was a doctor and started a hospital in Guatemala. Which do you think has had more positive effect on the world? One of you guys comes us with a web 2.0 startup selling advertisements, makes 10 million dollars for yourself, has no kids, and then the site dies after 5 years, you die 50 years later. Or the guy who never made a huge amount of money, but started a hospital? His name may not be remembered, but his contribution has an effect on people everyday.


Few logical errors there.

1) You can share stories with lots of people other than grand kids. Try having a wife, friends, or a blog. 2) Guy who makes 10 million and donates 1 of it probably has more positive effect on the world. I'm not sure what the going rate on a Guatemalan hospital is, but sure it's less than that. 3) One living startup founder is by far the biggest philanthropist of all time, and has raised and begun to deploy an amount of charity money that could probably double the number of hospitals in the world and still have 3/4 of its funds left. He'll likely do more to wipe out malaria than all of humanity has up to this point.


Nice subtle racism. "I'm not sure what the going rate on a Guatemalan hospital is, but I'm sure it's less than [1 million dollars]". A million dollars barely buys you an MRI machine - which would cost the same no matter where you are since it is an international market. A million dollars doesn't build a building, even if you think Mexico is cheaper, it is not 1/500th of the price.

Preceded by "try having .. a blog". Yes, the father/son connection and the blog/reader connection are definitely comparable. I see your point, and will now sever family ties in favor of blogging.

And then you site Bill Gates - as if that is a typical startup founder. Not even sure what that has to do with anything.


May I encourage you to raise your vision from "having kids" to something more meaningful? Maybe we could call it raising children to maturity.

You will never have a chance at impressing anyone as deeply as those you call your children. And I for one do care what happens after I'm dead.

"I have no greater joy than to hear that my children walk in truth." (3 John 1:4)


Did you just quote the bible in an argument? Am I having nightmares?


I'm pretty glad Jonas Salk's forebears didn't share your opinions on "immortality". Fortunately, yours is one of the rare misapprehensions that self-corrects. ;)


In a bit of stereotypical geekery, anyone remember the star trek episode where they pick up the fighter pilot when they go to the past, and realize they can't keep him because he's sort of a nobody, but his kid will be someone very important?


YOU may have had great experiences, but if you have no one with to share them, after you die they are gone.

Shall I introduce you to the phenomena known as "writing" and "publishing"? No, wait! I see you've already discovered them for yourself!

There are also concepts like "teaching", "friendship", "neighborliness", and "public service" that you might like to explore. If you die without kids and "nobody blinks an eye"... it's not because you didn't have kids.


ah. sure. timr wins this one ;)


I strongly suspect there are probably a few comparable studies out there that draw quite different conclusions and I think it's too bad the author didn't do a better job of covering the actual details of the studies as well as the results of the overall research in this area.


Wouldn't it make sense to first check if there are different conclusions before you declare "it's too bad" the writer failed to mention them? Google has this new feature called Search. You might like it.

I strongly suspect our happiness is controlled by drugs in our water system, but the author failed to cover research in the area of "I make shit up on the internet".




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: