> Have you never heard a little girl scream? It's not the same as the sound of a little boy.
I disagree, all little humans learn how to make that piercing scream often attributed to little girls. Little boys will likely do it less as they begin to be socialized and thus wedged into gender roles, but they definitely do "scream like little girls".
> I disagree, all little humans learn how to make that piercing scream often attributed to little girls.
You apparently don't actually know any little boys and girls because their screams sound nothing alike. Boys do manage a nice scream, but it doesn't sound the same, especially past the age of 3.
> Little boys will likely do it less as they begin to be socialized and thus wedged into gender roles
Again with this nonsense canard? Why is there such an inability to recognize that boys and girls are different? Next you'll tell me people aren't born knowing what gender they are, but rather it's "socialized" into them.
A desire for equality will not be achieved by erasing all differences, but by celebrating all differences, and recognizing each is valuable in its own way.
> You apparently don't actually know any little boys and girls because their screams sound nothing alike. Boys do manage a nice scream, but it doesn't sound the same, especially past the age of 3.
I worked as a neurology technician for four years, doing tests on a patient load that was half paediatric, plenty of whom had an induced drowsy state to bring out epileptic activity. Drowsy kid, strange environment, strange person touching their head, and sometimes autistic. For four years, I spent half the day in the presence of children's screams. I promise you that they don't sound different, and certainly not to the qualitative level you're trying to shoehorn in here.
And seriously, it's not like the statement was a neutral explanation. It's a trope - no-one says "run away screaming like a little boy". Trying to defend it as a serious qualitative explanation of the actual sound made is nonsense.
> A desire for equality will not be achieved by erasing all differences, but by celebrating all differences, and recognizing each is valuable in its own way.
I wholeheartedly agree - we need to recognise people as individuals and individual differences. Hence why we need to drop generalising tropes like "run away screaming like a little girl", because they are about stereotypes, not individuality. There are plenty of girls out there who don't do that - my mother's earliest memory is of patting a hairy spider, for example. No 'running away screaming' for that individual.
How on earth you defend "like a [demographic]" as some sort of comment in support of recognising individuality is beyond me.
[1] is a paper showing adults can distinguish boys' and girls' voices from age 4. The "mean fundamental frequency" is the same for boys and girls, but the "formant spacing" (differences in pitches of adjacent vowels, I think) was different.
> Next you'll tell me people aren't born knowing what gender they are, but rather it's "socialized" into them.
That just depends on what you mean by gender. There are many things around gender that are social constructs. For example, pink being a "feminine" colour. Do you believe that DNA encodes females to prefer pink[1]?
Completely aside from the current politically charged discussion, I recently read an interesting paper by Psychologist Marcio Del Giudice which claims that "pink for boys, blue for girls" is a scientific urban legend. He uses the Google Ngram Viewer of historical books and finds that the relevant terms for that theory never appear in the corpus, while the relation that is currently the societal norm appears back into the late 1800s (the beginning of the corpus).[1]
Of course, the article you reference doesn't claim that there was a reversal as many others do, but that the colors were simply not as gendered in the past, which seems almost certainly true.
Since voices don't change until puberty -- any kid screaming sounds the same.
And in the vein of special individuals, there are little girls who love and hate insects, and little boys who love and hate insects. Perhaps a more original phrase or analogy would be better: I would scream like a Dryococelus australis being attacked by rats.
Where? How? There is no such thing said anywhere - if you made such connection in your brain then well, it's your problem. It's a description of a sound, nothing more, nothing less.
You strike me as the kind of person who literally believes in everything a politician says, and is unaware of subtexts. If you think that all that people say is only the pure literal surface meaning of their words, than that is very much your problem, not mine.
Also, the trope is "run away, screaming like a little girl", not just "screaming like a little girl".
I think this is a general problem with us programmers - we read everything incredibly literally. If you want to read into subtext then please do, but I don't see it. Fortunately I am not interested in politics.
So what is the problem then? If they sound the same, then what difference does it make if he said "scream like a little girl" or "scream like a little boy" or "scream as a child"?
There are two ways to interpret this. One is the very literal level. Comparing a boys scream to a girls scream. This is what you and many others in this thread do. Is there anything unique about a little boy's scream over a little girl's scream? They're of slightly different pitches but there's hardly any real "difference" that makes one unique and in need of protection from being "washed away".
So then you take a step back and stop being so literal (which is also nonsensical because the scream of either young child would suffice in the example) and say "Why is the expression always 'scream like a little girl' vs 'scream like a little boy?" Why would a grown male say 'little girl" and change sexes in their example? It's because we have a stereotype of girls being more fearful and generally inadequate when faced with such things than boys. A small girl screaming is cute and funny because it reinforces stereotypes around them needing protection and not being self sufficient. A small boy screaming is not cute and funny as boy's are expected to be brave and not scared - it's a sign of weakness if they do. It's an inaccurate stereotype and slightly demeans girls and/or sends messages on our how they're supposed to act. "Screamed like a little girl. Throws a ball like a girl" It's death by a thousand little subtle lashes.
So "would scream like a scared little child" conveys perfectly what you might want to get across without demeaning one sex over the other. If you want to be sex specific then use your own vs feeling the need to switch to the other side.
You know, I was a military wife for many years. I have lived in places with big, ugly-assed spiders and poisonous snakes and scorpions and fun stuff like that. I grew up with a knife collection and my daddy taught me to shoot a gun by, say, age 8. I was a damn good shot as a kid. When I lived in Germany, I walked everywhere with an infant strapped to my chest and a backpack (often full of groceries) and a toddler often on my shoulders for the walk home. I had the respect of the soldiers, who knew what it was like to hike with a 60 lb. rucksack. A couple of years later, at a different duty station on another continent, I ran into a guy on base. I had no clue who he was, but he sure as hell remembered me hiking everywhere, doing the macho mom routine.
And I would scream like a little girl if I had to be faced with these tree lobsters -- just like I do when faced with flying, giant roaches in godforsaken swampy Georgia.
Give me a big assed spider or snake any day.
You can keep all your conjecture about what wusses little girls are supposed to be. I'm no wuss. Scream like a little girl conveys an evocative image of someone being shrill. The big difference between little girls and little boys is that little girls have the world's permission to express their feelings. Little boys are supposed to "not cry" and shit like that.
Also, while we are having this conversation: The correct interpretation of "Fights like a girl" is "So, they fight dirty?" Have you ever seen a cat fight in junior high? Gebus. Claws in your face and hair being torn out.
FYI: Statistically speaking, if you get into a knife fight with a man, you are highly likely to come away with minor defensive wounds on your arms because men are aggressive and will attack overhanded. Women don't want to cut you. They hold it low down, in a defensive position, and only cut you if you push them into the position of a cornered rat. The result: They gut you or stick it up under your ribs into a vital organ, like your heart. You are much more likely to die from being knifed by a woman than a man.
So maybe you should educate yourself a bit more about what really goes on in this world before you lecture people about promoting gender stereotypes. Because your bias is showing and it isn't pretty at all.
So you say girls aren't more scared of rats than boys? They don't scream louder and longer when looking at a little mouse in the corner? They are all macho in your delusional worldview, right?
Can you think of any scientific reason to defend why that would be the case Mania? If not then it's not nature it's nurture. Which is my point. And somewhat ironic you used the term "macho" wouldn't ya say? :)
> Can you think of any scientific reason to defend why that would be the case
Yes. Because they are girls. I don't know what deluded world, or ultra PC world, you live in where boys and girls are the same, or act the same.
The existence of girls that don't scream, and boys that do, despite no difference in nurture is the evidence that it's entirely nature.
It's not absolute "all girls scream", it's simply that more girls than boys do so - much more. And there is nothing whatsoever wrong with that, or with noticing that.
Here you have your science my dear marxist ideologue: girls have tear channels about 4 times larger than boys. Also testosterone prevents/helps to stop crying.
But you really don't care about science. Because you are marxist ideologue and not scientist.
Just next time when firemen rescue people trapped in house demand that in 50% cases they rescue men first. Fight this female hurting culture it is 2015 for goodness sake!!! Not that human genome haven't changed in any significant way in the past 10,000 years
It is better because as anti-feminism claims feminism is all about taking rights from children to give them to women. From language remarks like this, through having mom at home, to abortion... It is all about women right to neglect children to do whatever else they wanna do. A bit like male who prefers lying down on coach to doing any work -- disgusting.
I can't tell from the username and I have no other information, but if grondilu is a girl, and perhaps a young one at that, it would be perfectly reasonable for her to expect to scream like one. Otherwise the comment was simply outrageous sexism. How dreadful that we can't tell!
